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Aleksa
19-03-2014, 19:25
Mutual Intelligibility of Languages in theSlavic Family
By Robert Lindsay
There is much nonsense said about the mutual intelligibility of thevarious languages in the Slavic family. It's often said that all Slaviclanguages are mutually intelligible with each other. This is simply notthe case.Let us look first of all at
Serbo-Croatian
, since there is much nonsensefloating around about this language. The main dialects of Croatian,Serbian, Montenegrin and Bosnian are apparently mutually intelligible.However, Croatian has strange dialects that
Standard Croatian(Štokavian)
cannot understand.For instance,
Čakavian Croatian
isnot intelligiblewith StandardCroatian. It consists of at least two languages,
Ekavian Croatian
spoken on the Istrian Peninsula, and
Ikavian Croatian
, spoken insouthwestern Istria, the islands of Brač, Hvar, Vis, Korčula, Pelješac,the Dalmatian coast at Zadar and Split, and inland at Gacka.In addition,
Kajkavian Croatian
, spoken in northwest Croatia andsimilar to Slovenian, is not intelligible with Standard Croatian.
Molise Croatian
is a Croatian language spoken in a few towns in Italy,such asAcquaviva Collecroce. The Croatians left Croatia and came toItaly around 1300. Molise Croatian isnot intelligiblewith StandardCroatian.
Burgenland Croatian
, spoken in Austria, is intelligible to Croatianspeakers in Austria, Czech Republic, Slovakia and Hungary, but itisnot intelligiblewith Croatian spoken in Croatia. Therefore, there are 6separate Croatian languages: Shtovakian Croatian, Kajkavian Croatian,Istrian or Čakavian Croatian, Brac-Hvar Croatian, Molise Croatian andBurgenland Croatian.Serbian is made up to two languages.
Shtovakian Serbian
and
Torlak Serbian
. Torlak Serbian is spoken in the south and southwest of Serbiaand is transitional to Macedonian. It is not intelligible with Shtovakian.





It's also said that Serbo-Croatian can understand Slovenian, Bulgarianand Macedonian, but this is not true.Intelligibility in the Slavic languages of the Balkans is muchexaggerated.
Slovenian
finds it hard to understand much of the others.
Bulgarian
and
Macedonian
can understand each other to a greatdegree (85%), but not completely. However, the
Ser-Drama-Lagadin-Nevrokop dialect
in northeastern Greece and southern Bulgaria andthe
Maleševo-Pirin dialect
in eastern Macedonia and western Bulgarianare transitional between Bulgarian and Macedonian.Russian has a quite high degree of intelligibility with Bulgarian,possibly on the order of 75%.
Bosnian
, Croatian and Serbian (Shtokvakian) of course can understandeach other.Slovenian and Serbo-Croatian havepoor intelligibility, about 30%intelligibility. Yet there is a dialect continuum between Slovenian andCroatian. The Kajkavian dialect of Croatian, especially the HrvatskoZagorje dialect around Zagreb iscloseto the Shtajerska dialect of Slovene. However, leaving aside that one dialect, Croatians have poorintelligibility of Slovenian.Serbo-Croatian and Bulgarian have about 10% intelligibility, however,there are
transitional Bulgarian dialects
that are transitional withTorlak Serbian.Serbians in Belgrade have about 25% intelligibility with Macedonian,while Nis Serbians have ~90% intelligibility with Macedonian. Croatssay Macedonian is acomplete mysteryto them. Macedonians are oftenable to understand Serbo-Croatian due to heavy bilingual learning. Infact, many Macedonians are switching away from the Macedonianlanguage towards Serbo-Croatian.Czech and Polish are incomprehensible to Serbo-Croatian, but Serbo-Croatian has some limited comprehension of Slovak, on the order of 30% or so.Serbo-Croatian and Russian have about 5% intelligibility, if that.

Slovenians have a very hard time understanding Poles and Czechs andvice versa.It's often said that Czechs and Poles can understand each other,
but this is not so
.
Czech
and
Polish
have some intelligibility, but it's hard tosay how much - possibly on the order of 40%. It's definitely less thanPortuguese and Spanish.The intelligibility of Polish and Russian is very low, maybe on the orderof 5-10%.It is often said that
Ukrainian
and
Russian
are intelligible with eachother or even that they are the same language (Russian nationalists).It is
not true at all that Ukrainian and Russian are mutually intelligible
,as Ukrainian and Russian may have40-70% intelligibility. Forexample, all Russian shows getsubtitleson Ukrainian TV. However,there are dialects
in between
Ukrainian and Russian that are intelligiblewith both languages.On the other hand,
Belorussian
has some dialects that are intelligiblewith some dialects of both Russian and Ukrainian. However,Belorussian is nonetheless a separate language from both Ukrainianand Russian. For instance,
West Palesian
is a transitional Belorussiandialect to Ukrainian. Whether or not West Palesian then qualifies as aseparate language is not known.Nevertheless, Russian has very high intelligibility of Belorussian,possibly on the order of 85%. Intelligibility of Russian with Ukrainian isconsiderably lower - possibly on the order of 70% - mostly becausesince independence, the authorities have strove to make the newUkrainian as far away from Russian as possible. Hence, Russians canunderstand colloquial Ukrainian spoken in the countryside pretty wellbut understand the modern standard heard on TV much less. This isbecause colloquial Ukrainian is closer to the Ukrainian spoken in theSoviet era, which had huge Russian influence.From some reason, the Hutsul, Lemko, Boiko dialects (smallUkrainian/Rusyn dialects) are much more comprehensible to Russiansthan Standard Ukrainian is. Intelligibility may be on the order of 85%.The intelligibility of Czech and Slovak ismuch exaggerated. It is truethat West Slovak dialects can understand Czech, but Central, East andExtraslovakian dialects cannot. Further,
West Slovak
(Bratislava)

cannot understand
East Slovak
, so Slovak is actually two differentlanguages.Much of the claimed intelligibility was simply bilingual learning. Sincethe breakup, young Czechs and Slovaks understand each other worseand worse since they have less contact with each other.Intelligibility of Czech and Slovakis around 82%, and varies from 70-95% depending on the dialect. Intelligibility problems are mostly onthe Czech end, because they don't bother to learn Slovak, while manySlovaks learn Czech. There is as much Czech literature and media asSlovak literature and media in Slovakia, and many Slovaks study atCzech universities. When there, they have to pass a language test.Czechs hardly ever study at Slovak universities. Czechs see Slovaks ascountry bumpkins, backwards, folksy but optimistic, outgoing andfriendly. Czechs are more urbane. The written languages are muchmore different than the spoken ones.The languages really split about 1000 years ago, but written Slovakwas based on written Czech and there was a lot of interlingualcommunication. A Moravian Czech speaker (eastern Czech) and aBratislavan Slovak (Western Slovak) speaker understand each othervery well. In the former Czechoslovakia, everything was 50-50bilingual, media, literature, etc. Since then, Slovak has beendisappearing from the Czech Republic, so the younger people don'tunderstand Slovak so well.All foreign movies are translated into Czech, not Slovak. Farnortheastern Slovak (Saris) near the Polish border is close to Polishand Ukrainian. Southern Slovakia on the Hungarian border has aharder time understanding Polish because they do not hear it much.Russian has quite poor intelligibility with Slovak (maybe 15%) andbasically zero intelligibility with Czech.
Ruthenian
is an interesting language that few have heard of. It is like amixturebetween Polish, Ukrainian and Eastern Slovak. There aremany of them living in Eastern Slovakia.
http://www.academia.edu/4080349/Mutual_Intelligibility_of_Languages_in_the_Slavic_ Family

Aleksa
19-03-2014, 19:29
Valjda sam pogodio PDF. :D
Tekst govori o međusobnoj razumljivosti između slovenskih jezika.

ZGabriel
19-03-2014, 19:30
Aleksiću, jel ti to dovodiš kolege na forum, pa da imate temu? :kes

Aleksa
19-03-2014, 19:40
Malo uređeniji tekst

Mutual Intelligibility of Languages in the Slavic Family
By Robert Lindsay

There is much nonsense said about the mutual intelligibility of thevarious languages in the Slavic family. It's often said that all Slaviclanguages are mutually intelligible with each other. This is simply notthe case.Let us look first of all at Serbo-Croatian, since there is much nonsensefloating around about this language. The main dialects of Croatian,Serbian, Montenegrin and Bosnian are apparently mutually intelligible. However, Croatian has strange dialects that Standard Croatian(Štokavian)
cannot understand. For instance, Čakavian Croatian is not intelligiblewith StandardCroatian. It consists of at least two languages, Ekavian Croatian spoken on the Istrian Peninsula, and Ikavian Croatian, spoken insouthwestern Istria, the islands of Brač, Hvar, Vis, Korčula, Pelješac,the Dalmatian coast at Zadar and Split, and inland at Gacka. In addition, Kajkavian Croatian, spoken in northwest Croatia andsimilar to Slovenian, is not intelligible with Standard Croatian. Molise Croatian is a Croatian language spoken in a few towns in Italy, such asAcquaviva Collecroce. The Croatians left Croatia and came toItaly around 1300. Molise Croatian isnot intelligible with Standard Croatian. Burgenland Croatian, spoken in Austria, is intelligible to Croatianspeakers in Austria, Czech Republic, Slovakia and Hungary, but it is not intelligiblewith Croatian spoken in Croatia. Therefore, there are 6 separate Croatian languages: Shtovakian Croatian, Kajkavian Croatian, Istrian or Čakavian Croatian, Brac-Hvar Croatian, Molise Croatian and Burgenland Croatian.
Serbian is made up to two languages. Shtovakian Serbian and Torlak Serbian. Torlak Serbian is spoken in the south and southwest of Serbiaand is transitional to Macedonian. It is not intelligible with Shtovakian. It's also said that Serbo-Croatian can understand Slovenian, Bulgarian and Macedonian, but this is not true.Intelligibility in the Slavic languages of the Balkans is much exaggerated. Slovenian finds it hard to understand much of the others. Bulgarian and Macedonian
can understand each other to a greatdegree (85%), but not completely. However, the Ser-Drama-Lagadin-Nevrokop dialect in northeastern Greece and southern Bulgaria and the Maleševo-Pirin dialect in eastern Macedonia and western Bulgarian are transitional between Bulgarian and Macedonian.

Russian has a quite high degree of intelligibility with Bulgarian, possibly on the order of 75%. Bosnian, Croatian and Serbian (Shtokvakian) of course can understandeach other. Slovenian and Serbo-Croatian havepoor intelligibility, about 30%intelligibility. Yet there is a dialect continuum between Slovenian andCroatian. The Kajkavian dialect of Croatian, especially the HrvatskoZagorje dialect around Zagreb iscloseto the Shtajerska dialect of Slovene. However, leaving aside that one dialect, Croatians have poor intelligibility of Slovenian. Serbo-Croatian and Bulgarian have about 10% intelligibility, however,there are transitional Bulgarian dialects
that are transitional with Torlak Serbian. Serbians in Belgrade have about 25% intelligibility with Macedonian, while Nis Serbians have ~90% intelligibility with Macedonian. Croats say Macedonian is acomplete mystery to them. Macedonians are often able to understand Serbo-Croatian due to heavy bilingual learning. Infact, many Macedonians are switching away from the Macedonian language towards Serbo-Croatian. Czech and Polish are incomprehensible to Serbo-Croatian, but Serbo-Croatian has some limited comprehension of Slovak, on the order of 30% or so. Serbo-Croatian and Russian have about 5% intelligibility, if that. Slovenians have a very hard time understanding Poles and Czechs and vice versa. It's often said that Czechs and Poles can understand each other, but this is not so.
Czech and Polish have some intelligibility, but it's hard tosay how much - possibly on the order of 40%. It's definitely less than Portuguese and Spanish.The intelligibility of Polish and Russian is very low, maybe on the order of 5-10%. It is often said that Ukrainian and Russian are intelligible with each other or even that they are the same language (Russian nationalists). It is not true at all that Ukrainian and Russian are mutually intelligible, as Ukrainian and Russian may have 40-70% intelligibility. Forexample, all Russian shows get subtitleson Ukrainian TV. However, there are dialects in between Ukrainian and Russian that are intelligible with both languages. On the other hand, Belorussian has some dialects that are intelligible with some dialects of both Russian and Ukrainian. However,Belorussian is nonetheless a separate language from both Ukrainian and Russian. For instance, West Palesian is a transitional Belorussian dialect to Ukrainian. Whether or not West Palesian then qualifies as aseparate language is not known.Nevertheless, Russian has very high intelligibility of Belorussian,possibly on the order of 85%. Intelligibility of Russian with Ukrainian isconsiderably lower - possibly on the order of 70% - mostly becausesince independence, the authorities have strove to make the newUkrainian as far away from Russian as possible. Hence, Russians canunderstand colloquial Ukrainian spoken in the countryside pretty wellbut understand the modern standard heard on TV much less. This isbecause colloquial Ukrainian is closer to the Ukrainian spoken in theSoviet era, which had huge Russian influence.From some reason, the Hutsul, Lemko, Boiko dialects (smallUkrainian/Rusyn dialects) are much more comprehensible to Russiansthan Standard Ukrainian is. Intelligibility may be on the order of 85%.The intelligibility of Czech and Slovak ismuch exaggerated. It is truethat West Slovak dialects can understand Czech, but Central, East andExtraslovakian dialects cannot. Further, West Slovak (Bratislava) cannot understand East Slovak, so Slovak is actually two differentlanguages.Much of the claimed intelligibility was simply bilingual learning. Sincethe breakup, young Czechs and Slovaks understand each other worseand worse since they have less contact with each other.Intelligibility of Czech and Slovakis around 82%, and varies from 70-95% depending on the dialect. Intelligibility problems are mostly onthe Czech end, because they don't bother to learn Slovak, while many Slovaks learn Czech. There is as much Czech literature and media as Slovak literature and media in Slovakia, and many Slovaks study at Czech universities. When there, they have to pass a language test.Czechs hardly ever study at Slovak universities. Czechs see Slovaks ascountry bumpkins, backwards, folksy but optimistic, outgoing andfriendly. Czechs are more urbane. The written languages are muchmore different than the spoken ones.The languages really split about 1000 years ago, but written Slovakwas based on written Czech and there was a lot of interlingualcommunication. A Moravian Czech speaker (eastern Czech) and aBratislavan Slovak (Western Slovak) speaker understand each othervery well. In the former Czechoslovakia, everything was 50-50bilingual, media, literature, etc. Since then, Slovak has beendisappearing from the Czech Republic, so the younger people don'tunderstand Slovak so well.All foreign movies are translated into Czech, not Slovak. Farnortheastern Slovak (Saris) near the Polish border is close to Polishand Ukrainian. Southern Slovakia on the Hungarian border has aharder time understanding Polish because they do not hear it much.Russian has quite poor intelligibility with Slovak (maybe 15%) andbasically zero intelligibility with Czech.
Ruthenian is an interesting language that few have heard of. It is like a mixture between Polish, Ukrainian and Eastern Slovak. There aremany of them living in Eastern Slovakia.
http://www.academia.edu/4080349/Mutual_Intelligibility_of_Languages_in_the_Slavic_ Family

Aleksa
19-03-2014, 19:42
Aleksiću, jel ti to dovodiš kolege na forum, pa da imate temu? :kes

Nije, nego mi interesantno kako npr. autor tvrdi da se hrvatski sastoji od 6 različitih jezika. :D
Therefore, there are 6 separate Croatian languages: Shtovakian Croatian, Kajkavian Croatian, Istrian or Čakavian Croatian, Brac-Hvar Croatian, Molise Croatian and Burgenland Croatian.

ZGabriel
19-03-2014, 19:49
Nije, nego mi interesantno kako npr. autor tvrdi da se hrvatski sastoji od 6 različitih jezika. :D
Therefore, there are 6 separate Croatian languages: Shtovakian Croatian, Kajkavian Croatian, Istrian or Čakavian Croatian, Brac-Hvar Croatian, Molise Croatian and Burgenland Croatian.

za početak, autor je nepismen. :D ovo bi valjda trebalo biti Shtokavian iliti štokavski. i to nisu različiti jezici nego narječja.
onda valjda i u Srbiji ima barem toliko različitih jezika, jel tako? :zubo